Comments on: 10 Things I Want Musicians to Know

By: Steph

Steph — Wed, 29 Apr 2009 05:02:06 +0000

I’m not in the biz, but this post is fantastic and I’m just stopping by to lol at the sad, self-aggrandizing nonsense that “BB” wrote.

By: Candace

Candace — Tue, 28 Apr 2009 22:03:40 +0000

Re: BB, Ah, the good ol’ days. I keep hearing about those. But I’m pretty convinced that the good ol’days are now.

I could put on an excellent festival with just a bunch of my friends, over and over, every year. But my responsibility is larger than just my own taste and friendships – I receive public funding, and I believe that with it comes a responsibility to think about the wider community, not just my buddies. I make new friends every year with the people I book; we’re a family extended across Canada, not just my neighborhood.

My festival’s free, but we pay performers, and we have workshops and unamplified stages and jams and lovely, unexpected moments where people come together. People from all walks of life come through the festival park, because they can afford it – young families, teenagers, large families, seniors, new Canadians, people riding their bikes on their way somewhere else who stumble across the festival unexpectedly.

I’d hire more musicians if I thought I could decently pay more; I would feel like a slimeball if I paid any less than I do. Love’s great, but it doesn’t pay for your food and gas from Nova Scotia to Peterborough.

By: BB

BB — Tue, 28 Apr 2009 07:07:42 +0000

I say we need more, yea, many more festivals@25 acts each ..it would seem that maybe 33 or more, to start with..I’m lucky I suppose, that I don’t have to be on the defensive when I put on our Grand Garden Picnic. I simply call acts I would like to see in the space with each other. Thats the way it was done friends..at least in the early days of festivals. Someone says..I’d like you to be here next year..and then the application is a formality to remind them of your availability.
Some Ad,s must really be uptight.. In the 10 Commandments above I see someone who really needs therapy, and a week away. It seems so pushy, like the last breath of a long day. Now, me I have a tranquillity garden …come to my Garden…any garden..
Folk fests are only one part of the music scene and there are hundreds of nice little gigs out there..I enjoy opening places up or making my own work. there’s way too much desperation in what was and should remain a big friendly family. People have forgotten the root of it all..Playing for the love of it. Sharing it. Passing it on. I really miss the little circles of music that happened between pickers in the 60s.-70.The sound systems where folky enough that you could play and hear yourself in the park .Bruce Cockburn and I enjoyed picking under a tree at Miraposa ’69 for an hour while people came and went. His,”Goin’ to the country”, must have been played 40 times that morning. I miss that “sit down and pick” thing.
The 800 left-over musicians, and only a few will come, hired or not, only need a day pass or at least a shady secure place to check their instruments, and they get to play a bit on the grounds and be part of the big picture.networking into a stronger community, future voice of the people, etc etc. I think a few song circles takes off a lot of steam, and contributes endlessly. Some musicians are bound to be discovered and the organic process is secured for the future.

By: smartygirl

smartygirl — Mon, 27 Apr 2009 14:55:24 +0000

brilliant! i work in funding, and i kind of wish everybody in the world would read this post and take it to heart… sigh.

By: Ben

Ben — Mon, 27 Apr 2009 04:25:59 +0000

My song ‘Who killed the last folksinger?’ kind of deals with this stuff. on the outset it sounds like a typical musician complaining about the biz etc, but if you really listen you realize the narrator is saying everyone and no one are to blame including the folksinger, stuff happens and people are desperately fallible, some have thicker skin, some don’t give a crap, some are guided by what they think they should think or say, some were drunk when they wrote that, some were pandering to their agent, some were preaching to the converted, some didn’t mean to come off that way, some weren’t interested, some were annoyed by the million calls they had already had n which they were pretty kind and that one just got off unlucky,, some were misunderstood, some were already so far on the defensive they didn’t actually read the thing and jumped to the wrong conclusion, some expected to be treated that way….

ha ha, its pretty great when you take a step outside and really look at it all. Anyway, we all go through shit and some of us deal with it better than others. I am glad you wrote this, whether people take it the right way or wrong, instigators and triggers are what gets brains spinning, thoughts a rolling and dirt cleared out of the way. I am writing too long here, back to the songs, three this week, the first in moons.
cheers

By: Candace

Candace — Sun, 26 Apr 2009 20:49:54 +0000

Hey Ben, Thanks!
I agree; you should treat everyone with respect, no matter what. I probably could have worded that better.

I also agree on your next point; ADs and other talent buyers don’t feel the effects of bad behaviour like artists do. I know one promoter who constantly ripped people off, was banned from several venues and worked over in parking lots by angry musicians, but people kept working with him. I guess it’s harder to get the word out.

I don’t have patience for anybody who walks into a situation with an attitude, whoever they are; I think hipsters and divas are desperately insecure people downloading their issues onto everyone around them. Whether artist, volunteer, or whatever, I won’t work with anyone like that. No one is so skilled or talented that I’ll put up with a crazy-maker.

By: Ben

Ben — Sun, 26 Apr 2009 20:09:48 +0000

I enjoyed reading this.its the things that everybody knows that we need to be reminded of, you read and it and you go, oh, yeah , I know this.
I have to slightly disagree with you on point number 9, I don’t think it matters if you are the AD or the portapottie technician, everyone is due the same treatment,whether it helps your career or not.

if an AD is a prick, we are supposed to take it lying down or we are the bad guy, if a volunteer is rude or snotty or whatever, its forgotten or at least has no long term effects, but if an artist is a jerk, rude, unfriendly or whatever everybody finds out quickly and the long term effects can be very damaging, but that has a lot to do with a very small pie and too many berries! thats been my observation. The main thing is there are no devils and angels here, its incidentals to circumstances, thats all.

By: Candace

Candace — Sat, 25 Apr 2009 22:22:58 +0000

Re: Steve, I really think the contempt you’re finding comes from a misreading on your part, not from what I wrote.
I’ve been hired to book acts and run the organization. My priority is a good gig for everyone; my team are all terrific, smart, skilled, kind, ethical people – administrators, volunteers, artists, audience.

Re: Crystal, When you send resume to a job, you don’t hear back unless they want to talk to you; submissions are exactly the same. You assume that an employer looks at your resume in good faith, and you have to assume that a talent buyer does the same.

By: Crystal

Crystal — Sat, 25 Apr 2009 19:36:08 +0000

I agree with all points above but my problem is this. If you pay a fee to be considered you deserve a proper reply. Just receiving an automated – NOT ACCEPTED – email hardly makes an artist feel as though respect goes both ways. We personalize AND PAY FOR our applications, but the responses are not personalized. NO value for money spent.
In order to be sure they are indeed being heard vs being scammed (and you can’t tell me some of those Sonicbids apps are not money generating scams) it would make sense to offer some kind of response that is directed to them specifically that confirms that indeed their application was read/listened to.

And here’s the deal – if an AD could not possibly have time to attend personally to 750 applications, then they should not accept that many applications with the fees paid. That’s money taken for a service you know you can’t offer. They should stop at a reasonable amount of applications – not leave it open til the last moment of the deadline. They should accept only the amount they could feel confident about having the time to attend to personally. If after reviewing those applications they have not found all the acts they are looking for, they could return to the process. OR don’t charge a fee for consideration…that way when you ignore any requests for feedback on an application you can rightfully say you get what you pay for.

By: Steve

Steve — Sat, 25 Apr 2009 18:29:15 +0000

This list is, to me, a mix of common contempt with really great advice.

The really great advice: “It’s better if you behave as though you’re
dealing with a peer, no matter what your general assumptions about
talent buyers are.” And “Be calm, be polite, and be professional. ”
And “Always be nice/polite/respectful to staff and volunteers.”

HEAR, HEAR!!

These are things that swollen-head musicians (there are far too many
of these) ought to try and remember at all gigs. Too many don’t. Those
who hire musicians and help musicians get through gigs deserve
respect, thanks, and good manners. After all, to almost quote
Chilliwack’s song, “Rain-o”: if there ain’t no presenter, there ain’t
no show.

The common contempt is in other parts of the advice. At least five of
those remarks can be paraphrased as follows: “I’ve got more important
things to do, or to worry about, than you musicians.” Number 2–don’t
call me a second time if I don’t reply the first time; I’ve got other
things to do than respond to everyone. Number 4–I’m not ripping you
off; I have bigger things to worry about in my budget than you.
Number 7 and 8–I don’t care what you’ve done; I have more important people than you to answer to. Number 10–don’t ask me why you didn’t make the cut; I have more important things to do than tell you.

We all seem to accept the implication that the musician (band, act, soloist, whatever) is the least important factor in presenting a gig.

As you correctly point out, being a festival Artistic Director
means respecting a lot of people other than the talent: the staff,
venues, funders, and (by no means the least important) the audience. (To properly quote Chilliwack: if there ain’t no audience, there ain’t no show.)
And every one of those groups, it seems, has higher priority than the
talent. To speak of money alone: the venue rent has to be paid–the
sound people have to get paid–the cost of the liquor license has to
be recovered–the transportation for the musicians has to be paid
for–the hotel has to be paid–and so on and so on. All of these come
before paying the band. They’re just musicians. After all, you can
safely rip off a singer without harming your festival; try stiffing the
sound company, or the hotel, and see what happens to their
contribution to the next event. So musicians shouldn’t be surprised
to learn that there are more important things than the musicians to
be looked after.

Heck, I just got stiffed this month by a presenter who, when
approached after the gig about the money the entertainers had been
promised, actually said, “They’re just musicians.” Of course.

It’s just that eventually one gets tired of being treated like the
lowest slug in the swamp.

If I’m not of the stature of Leonard Cohen, or Frankie Armstrong, or
Billy Bob Thornton (sorry), all I can do is apply to a festival. Then
I wait. If I don’t get hired, I don’t get told. And I don’t get told
why not. And if I wonder what’s the problem, all I can do is remember
what you’ve said here: “Behave with respect, as though you’re dealing
with a peer. I’m not going to hire you, but it may not be because you
suck. Anyway, don’t expect me to return your respect by responding to
you. I have more important things to do.”

So, I guess I’m saying that the really good advice referred to above
should cut both ways. Presenters, ADs, club owners, talent buyers–
they also need to remember to deal with musicians as peers, and
remain calm, polite, and respectful to musicians, no matter what
their general assumptions about musicians are, and especially no matter whether they’re hiring them or not. After all, to almost quote Chilliwack
again: if there ain’t no music, there ain’t no show.